Let it be

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twoleftfeet
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Let it be

Post by twoleftfeet » Fri Apr 26, 2013 5:42 pm

` `

First draft: kick it around. Doc Martens are optional.


Let it be
**********************

The garden gate was gone. Walking on,
he saw the path was caving in to chaos:
a jungle of few flowers but a host
of thorns. He should've come back
sooner

While he'd been away he'd sent along
some promising apprentices - to lend
a hand, he'd said, explain the basics. One
was like a son to him; but there'd been a
misunderstanding.

The code was flawed - this much was plain:
the leeches and the canker should've been erased
by now. There was a time he might have torched
the lot: he could be fiery when
aroused.

Burn it.. Drown it.. This aimless tangle
would just grow back, so leave it be.
He'd other schemes to believe in, other
plots to weed and seeds to
sow.

There's no hope for the apple tree,
he divined. With perfect synchronicity
a flyspecked apple fell; he let it lie.
He wasn't there for au revoirs; this was
goodbye.
` `
Instead of just sitting on the fence - why not stand in the middle of the road?

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Re: Let it be

Post by ray miller » Fri Apr 26, 2013 7:28 pm

I like the last verse a lot and chaos/flowers is my kind of rhyme. I have problems with the 2nd verse

While he'd been away he'd sent along - I get the feeling that each he is the same person, but I'm by no means sure. Perhaps you need be clearer.
some promising apprentices - to lend
a hand, he'd said, explain the basics. One
was like a son to him; but there'd been a
misunderstanding.

The nature of the misunderstanding escapes me too - they've nicked his gate?

While he'd been away he'd sent some
promising apprentices - to lend - that might be better rhythm

The code was flawed - code? After that it's much simpler and enjoyable.
I'm out of faith and in my cups
I contemplate such bitter stuff.

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Re: Let it be

Post by David2 » Fri Apr 26, 2013 7:35 pm

I'm sure I know what this is, but I won't spoil the discovery for others. It's very good.

Cheers

David

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Re: Let it be

Post by Antcliff » Fri Apr 26, 2013 7:57 pm

Well, I think I know as well.....but for a while I'll let it be. Excellent if so.
We fray into the future, rarely wrought
Save in the tapestries of afterthought.
Richard Wilbur

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Re: Let it be

Post by ray miller » Fri Apr 26, 2013 8:08 pm

Yeah, I see it myself now.
This still a bit puzzling

He'd other schemes to believe in, other
plots to weed and seeds to
sow.

I'm reminded of one of my favourite jingles

God, most Himself when most unutterably vague,
talks, when His talk is plain, the most ungodliest bosh.
Repent! He says, for sin has caused the plague;
but we say dirt - so wash.
I'm out of faith and in my cups
I contemplate such bitter stuff.

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Re: Let it be

Post by twoleftfeet » Mon Apr 29, 2013 12:46 pm

Thanks, David and Seth
- yep, it's an allegodical-parabolical, innit..

Cheers, Ray

Taking another look at S2 I can see where you might be confused. It's all part of the vagueness-thru-necessity that you picked up on in your 2nd post, I suppose. Yes, I might have to lose "along" - although I quite like the repeat of the "o" sound with
"along/promising".
ray miller wrote: The nature of the misunderstanding escapes me too - they've nicked his gate?


:lol:
It was the only way I could think of to slide in "garden"..

ray miller wrote: He'd other schemes to believe in, other
plots to weed and seeds to
sow.


I was thinking he might have been to other worlds/planets - which would account for his long absence.
I quite like the idea of god needing to believe in something, as opposed to needing us to believe in him.
Instead of just sitting on the fence - why not stand in the middle of the road?

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Re: Let it be

Post by twoleftfeet » Mon Apr 29, 2013 12:54 pm

Your thoughts, please, peeps, on these points (or anything else you'd care to raise)

S1 / L2
he saw the path was caving in to chaos:

I'm thinking this might be clearer:

he saw the path was giving way to chaos:


S4 / L3
He'd other schemes to believe in

- would "dreams" be better? In the Hindu tradition the universe originated in a dream of Brahma, the creator god.
Instead of just sitting on the fence - why not stand in the middle of the road?

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Re: Let it be

Post by Antcliff » Mon Apr 29, 2013 3:52 pm

Thoughts below
on a very intriguing poem..


twoleftfeet wrote:` `

First draft: kick it around. Doc Martens are optional.


Let it be
**********************

The garden gate was gone. Walking on,
he saw the path was caving in to chaos:......."chaos" seems a strong phrase for an overgrown garden, even such a super one. Clearly something is being said by this phrase.. perfection has descended into chaos...but the significance of the selection is slightly elusive for me.

a jungle of few flowers but a host
of thorns. He should've come back
sooner...........................................something fresher for an under tended garden.."jungle" is over-used I think. But then I do descend from gardeners and have spent the morning digging out reeds.

While he'd been away he'd sent along
some promising apprentices - to lend
a hand, he'd said, explain the basics. One
was like a son to him; ..................."like" is clever here, plays on the familiar phrase but also points to the fact that he would not be a son in the, er, most familiar sense.

but there'd been
misunderstanding.

The code was flawed - this much was plain:...............not entirely sure what "this much was plain" is doing.
the leeches and the canker should've been erased
by now. There was a time he might have torched
the lot: he could be fiery when
aroused...........................................so the Old Testament period is over!

Burn it.. Drown it.. This aimless tangle
would just grow back, so leave it be..................so innately/intrinsically things tend to "tangle"....is this the return of a chaos metaphysics hinted at earlier?

He'd other schemes to believe in, other
plots to weed and seeds to
sow.

There's no hope for the apple tree,
he divined. With perfect synchronicity
a flyspecked apple fell; he let it lie.
He wasn't there for au revoirs; this was
goodbye.`


Do we need "apple" twice?
Farewell apple! `[/color]
We fray into the future, rarely wrought
Save in the tapestries of afterthought.
Richard Wilbur

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Re: Let it be

Post by David2 » Mon Apr 29, 2013 7:01 pm

Quick thought on Chaos (quick, because it's Monday night, and we don't have much time on Monday nights) - have you been reading Paradise Lost, Geoff?

http://www.christs.cam.ac.uk/darknessvi ... night.html

I will be back, when I have more time, because I like this a lot.

Cheers

David

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Re: Let it be

Post by Macavity » Mon Apr 29, 2013 7:14 pm

S1 / L2
he saw the path was caving in to chaos ......... with 'caving in' you have a suggestion of forcing with weight, I picture a roof not a path

I'm thinking this might be clearer:

he saw the path was giving way to chaos......I think the force of chaos is more abstract , way/path are too close in meaning, retain in?


S4 / L3
He'd other schemes to believe in

- would "dreams" be better? ...................no, 'schemes' is more grounded, ambiguous
Just my opinion Geoff. To be honest I don't find much to nit pick since I really like the poem.

cheers

mac

ps nice line breaks :)

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Re: Let it be

Post by Arian » Mon Apr 29, 2013 7:29 pm

Hi Geoff. Very nice piece. As to your questions:
twoleftfeet wrote:Your thoughts, please, peeps, on these points (or anything else you'd care to raise)

S1 / L2
he saw the path was caving in to chaos:

S4 / L3
He'd other schemes to believe in

- would "dreams" be better? In the Hindu tradition the universe originated in a dream of Brahma, the creator god.
1. Chaos. I'm agnostic on this. Caving works fine for me, strengthens the image, but giving has an appealing simplicity. It works both ways.

2. Schemes. I'm definitely committed on this one. Keep it. The whole piece reflects a tone of cynicism, which demands schemes. Dreams changes, even confuses, the tone, marking a shift from ungodly pragmatism (which underpins the basic humour of the piece) to idealism/romanticism, which merely serves to reinforce the conventional teleology of religion. In other words, dreams is not as witty.

Cheers
peter

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Re: Let it be

Post by ray miller » Tue Apr 30, 2013 11:04 am

I think schemes is much better than dreams, too, especially given your idea of Him being absorbed with other planets. The leeches and canker doesn't work so well for me as all the rest.
I'm out of faith and in my cups
I contemplate such bitter stuff.

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Re: Let it be

Post by twoleftfeet » Tue Apr 30, 2013 12:41 pm

Thanks for coming back in detail, Seth.
Antcliff wrote:
The garden gate was gone. Walking on,
he saw the path was caving in to chaos:......."chaos" seems a strong phrase for an overgrown garden, even such a super one. Clearly something is being said by this phrase.. perfection has descended into chaos...but the significance of the selection is slightly elusive for me.
Traditionally, religious people follow the "right-hand path", the bad guys follow the "left (sinister) hand path"
I was trying to imply that religion has lost out to science, primarily and the "moral compass" it provides is losing strength.
Also, yes - the universe is heading towards a state of entrophy and disorder.
Antcliff wrote: a jungle of few flowers but a host
of thorns. He should've come back
sooner...........................................something fresher for an under tended garden.."jungle" is over-used I think. But then I do descend from gardeners and have spent the morning digging out reeds.
I know it's a cliche, but at the same time it's a pretty good description of urban ghettos and "the survival of the fittest" too.
Antcliff wrote: The code was flawed - this much was plain:...............not entirely sure what "this much was plain" is doing.


The code is meant to be DNA, as if it were an "intelligently designed" phenomenom that had gone wrong - like a software
error.
Antcliff wrote: Burn it.. Drown it.. This aimless tangle
would just grow back, so leave it be..................so innately/intrinsically things tend to "tangle"....is this the return of a chaos metaphysics hinted at earlier?
- yes, because the code isn't working!

Antcliff wrote: Do we need "apple" twice?
Farewell apple!
- No. In fact, it reads more smoothly without it!
Instead of just sitting on the fence - why not stand in the middle of the road?

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Re: Let it be

Post by twoleftfeet » Tue Apr 30, 2013 12:46 pm

David2 wrote:Quick thought on Chaos (quick, because it's Monday night, and we don't have much time on Monday nights) - have you been reading Paradise Lost, Geoff?

http://www.christs.cam.ac.uk/darknessvi ... night.html

I will be back, when I have more time, because I like this a lot.

Cheers

David
David,
No I haven't been reading Paradise Lost. I wasn't thinking of "chaos" as a place.
- but I had a quick look at the link and was amazed to see:

There has been much debate as to the morality of these characters. Chaos sends Satan on his way with the words 'go and speed; | Havoc and spoil and ruin are my gain' (II.1009),
but as a place, Chaos is the 'womb of nature' (II.911), and holds the 'dark materials' (II.916) out of which God creates the universe.
The answer is perhaps in the moral neutrality of something that exists outside of the framework of Creation.

Instead of just sitting on the fence - why not stand in the middle of the road?

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Re: Let it be

Post by twoleftfeet » Tue Apr 30, 2013 12:53 pm

Macavity wrote:
S1 / L2
he saw the path was caving in to chaos ......... with 'caving in' you have a suggestion of forcing with weight, I picture a roof not a path

I'm thinking this might be clearer:

he saw the path was giving way to chaos......I think the force of chaos is more abstract , way/path are too close in meaning, retain in?


S4 / L3
He'd other schemes to believe in

- would "dreams" be better? ...................no, 'schemes' is more grounded, ambiguous
Just my opinion Geoff. To be honest I don't find much to nit pick since I really like the poem.

cheers

mac

ps nice line breaks :)
Cheers, Mac
I actually like the strong link between "path" and "way". :)
Schemes 1 Dreams 0
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Re: Let it be

Post by twoleftfeet » Tue Apr 30, 2013 12:56 pm

Arian wrote:Hi Geoff. Very nice piece. As to your questions:
twoleftfeet wrote:Your thoughts, please, peeps, on these points (or anything else you'd care to raise)

S1 / L2
he saw the path was caving in to chaos:

S4 / L3
He'd other schemes to believe in

- would "dreams" be better? In the Hindu tradition the universe originated in a dream of Brahma, the creator god.
1. Chaos. I'm agnostic on this. Caving works fine for me, strengthens the image, but giving has an appealing simplicity.
It works both ways.

2. Schemes. I'm definitely committed on this one. Keep it. The whole piece reflects a tone of cynicism, which demands schemes. Dreams changes, even confuses, the tone, marking a shift from ungodly pragmatism (which underpins the basic humour of the piece) to idealism/romanticism, which merely serves to reinforce the conventional teleology of religion. In other words, dreams is not as witty.

Cheers
peter
Thanks, Peter

It works both ways.
- very good :)

Geoff
Schemes 2 Dreams 0
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Re: Let it be

Post by twoleftfeet » Tue Apr 30, 2013 1:00 pm

ray miller wrote:I think schemes is much better than dreams, too, especially given your idea of Him being absorbed with other planets.
Thanks for coming back, Ray

Schemes 3 Dreams 0
Schemes it is, then.
ray miller wrote: The leeches and canker doesn't work so well for me as all the rest.
I'm open to suggestions: something that implies people, obviously.
Instead of just sitting on the fence - why not stand in the middle of the road?

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Re: Let it be

Post by ljordan » Tue Apr 30, 2013 2:43 pm

Also the opening has nice allusion to Hardy's 'Darkling Thrush' Also schemes and chaos work for me, fitting nicely with the allusions of the fall. Not sure the end has quite the punch it needs, though I've no suggestions at all.

larry

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Re: Let it be

Post by twoleftfeet » Tue Apr 30, 2013 5:35 pm

ljordan wrote:Also the opening has nice allusion to Hardy's 'Darkling Thrush' Also schemes and chaos work for me, fitting nicely with the allusions of the fall. Not sure the end has quite the punch it needs, though I've no suggestions at all.

larry
Thanks, Larry.
I'm glad schemes and chaos work for you.
Tbh I wasn't thinking of the Hardy poem but the allusion to "hope" certainly fits well enough - good spot!

All I wanted from the ending was to contrast god implying "you're on your own, people" while saying a word that derives from "god be with you". :)
Instead of just sitting on the fence - why not stand in the middle of the road?

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